Interview with Mr Moussa Mara, former Prime Minister of Mali and future presidential candidate

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« REJECTION OF POLICIES, ATTITUDES OR PARTICULAR BEHAVIOURS FINALLY BECOMES, AT LEAST IN PART, THE REJECTION OF A COUNTRY »

Mr. Prime Minister, could you provide us with an overview of the political situation in Mali?

The political situation in our country is one of political transition, an exceptional regime, with all its characteristics: uncertainties regarding the prospects, notably the return to constitutional order, defensive political parties, and many other political actors in a difficult position due to unpopularity, limitations on freedom of opinion, a strong polarization of the public scene driven by disinformation and other manipulations. It is also necessary to take into account the ever-volatile security context, despite a real increase in the capabilities of the armed forces and a greater state presence in the north of the country. Finally, the difficult economic context with significant social impacts undoubtedly also fuels tensions.

The era of coups d’état was thought to be over, but the Malian government seems to be holding its own. Can it rely on some popularity among the Malian people? How do you see the future?

The popularity of the military is real and, as many other analysts have pointed out, it is strongly based on the widespread rejection of the traditional political actors to whom our countries’ failures are attributed. The particular context of our countries, conducive to manipulation and disinformation, also nurtures the hope placed in the military. How long will this last? No one knows. There is a certain risk that the transition will take longer than the agreed deadlines. As we see with the sine die postponement of the elections originally scheduled for February 2024. We have to continue our political activities and continue to speak to the populations to work towards a gradual rehabilitation of politics. At the same time, we also need to maintain channels of discussion with the authorities to convince them that returning to constitutional order is positive for the country as well as for themselves. In the current context, time is not necessarily on the leaders’ side.

What are the notable developments in the security situation in Mali? What is the true role of the Wagner force in Mali and its record?

Our authorities do not recognize the presence of the Wagner force, indicating that they are rather cooperating with the Russian state through military instructors. I will therefore hold to this position. The efforts made by the transitional authorities in terms of equipment and recruitment have enabled a significant strengthening of the capabilities of our defense and security forces. This has notably allowed for a redeployment to the North and the occupation of the areas left by MINUSMA upon its departure. The most emblematic case is the city of Kidal which is once again under the control of the state for the first time in more than ten years. Russian cooperation has helped in various ways and this is positive. However, terrorist challenges remain significant in the country; around 1000 schools are closed in our country and hundreds of thousands of children have not been attending classes for years. We therefore have work to do in terms of security and military force alone will not be enough.

What are the priority measures to be taken in the Saharan region to counter the jihadist threat after the withdrawal of French troops?

Sahaélian jihadism is more of a rebellion against our states than an absolutist and violent Islamism that would seek to establish any kind of caliphate. The French forces have not sufficiently integrated this reality and have had a purely military approach, eventually realizing that it was not enough. They failed despite the resources deployed. Our forces, paradoxically, have the same approach. I have been saying this since 2016: if we do not work holistically on terrorism, we will fail. We need to work concurrently on security, judicial, administrative, socio-economic, cultural, and religious aspects. We have the advantage of having human resources and social organizations in our country that are able to effectively support the state in this direction. We must exert military pressure while opening up opportunities for combatants who wish to reintegrate into society. We must deploy a more just and equitable administration that repairs past mistakes to open up prospects for reconciliation. We must also open up opportunities for socio-political order at the local level that can borrow rules from religion; that is what I call giving substance to Malian secularism. Fighting terrorism requires at least as much intelligence as weapons!

France was expelled from Mali. The break-up was brutal. Is this, in your opinion, a general anti-French sentiment or rather the rejection of an inappropriate policy and behavior?

The rejection of particular policies, attitudes, or behaviors eventually became, at least in part, the rejection of a country. This comes at a time when we have socio-cultural relations that cannot be broken as we share a strong history, and our diasporas are the most concrete illustration of this. The same goes for the French language. I think we need to rewrite a new page in the history of our relations by starting from what unites us and looking lucidly at what divides us. This rewriting requires that in France we be careful about the words and attitudes we adopt towards Africa in general and Mali in particular.

How can we restore a link between the two countries? What role should the large Malian diaspora and binationals play in achieving this?

They must constitute the foundation from which to rebuild relations between the two countries. Culture, education, training, employment, economic cooperation, business investment, and sports are areas that work and must be prioritized to maintain and develop relations between the two countries. To do this, it is necessary to abandon confrontational attitudes and feelings of resentment, such as the cessation of the issuance of visas by both sides. The territorial communities offer another opportunity to continue cooperation between the two countries. The two States can use them to pursue other, more useful ways of establishing relations in the service of the populations.

How do you see your political future?

My political future will be political! that is, in the service of my country. I have just been nominated by my party as its candidate in the next presidential election, the date of which is not yet known (laughs). But we are patient and we will wait for the right moment to offer our compatriots a real project of gathering and change. Until then, we continue all our political actions to raise awareness and convince our compatriots. We try to be useful, helping those in need through our foundation for aid and development. We also travel around the country to meet our compatriots. We will continue to travel the world to give talks, participate in events, and maintain our ranks. Of course, we will maintain frank, sincere, and constructive relations with the transitional authorities to contribute to the success of this period and move towards a productive return to the constitutional order. You see that our political future will be very political!